Saturday, November 29, 2008

Dreams

Shani says:
"I say dreams are a mechanism of the mind to test any changes it makes to the model of the world (in our head), while we sleep.Say i watch a documentary on snakes. I already have a section on snakes in my head (part of the model of the world around me) that has all the 'relevant' information i have collected on snakes so far. Owing to what happend during the day, while i lay in bed and sleep, my mind goes to work to extract the new data (or extent of emphasis on old data/rules), and then wants to suppliment the old notion of snakes with the new data ... as it does that it needs to verify whether that change is good, i.e. wouldn't lead to me say getting bit by a snake cuz i stepped on it. So to verify, the mind creates a drama and lets my updated model react to it, i might see myself in a jungle and then a snake and the mind carefully monitors my reaction to it ... if everythign goes smooth, good, if not then maybe the changes weren't quite right ... "

I say:
"I think there is the biological and then there is the psychological function of dreams. It is not clear whether the dreams play a homeostatic role in our lives, meaning that they create the balance, re orient us and bring us to the center of our biological or our psychological lives.

I think you are right about dream being the censor for the change that occurs in our minds. I would though want to extend it by saying that introducing snake as a data in the mind means introducing various things in the mind. I would liken it to the mind going over the translation of the world that it did in the day time. I would think that is what you mean by going over the data.
The translation though would be a tricky thing because that would mean what is the data that the mind sees.
If I were wearing red spectacles I would interpret all data about colors as various shades of red. So it is interesting how the mind interprets the new data. In gross terms new data is interpreted, associated and then stored.
In the example of the snake. You dreamed about the snake. Your interpretation of the snake, i would think is a very biological phenomenon which involves integration of the lines and the colors and then naming it by comparing it to past experiences. The comparing part starts to spill over in to the psychological realm. Now when you compare it, the emotional significance of the snake will be brought forth. Freud felt that unconscious mind or the dreaming mind is involved with primary thinking. Thinking that would use primitive patterns of reaching conclusions. (See level I and level II defences). There are some bizarre explanations for a snake incidentally. Snake has been interpreted as a phallic symbol and the explanation is that the mind while associating it might recall a similar emotion (the one that the person might have felt on seeing a snake) associated with a similar form. Ofcourse there is a lot of "static" also going on in terms of defences and the resulting situation is bizarre dreams which need to be interpreted.

3 comments:

Unknown said...

On dreams playing a homeostatic role: I agree, i think i'm saying the same thing here but let me know if that is not the case. One thing is that dreams maybe be attempts at the recreation of the real world around us, if they end up not representing the real world, the person would wander off slowly and steadily into a world (read model of world in the brain) that would have nothing or almost nothing congruous with the real world.

On the translation of ideas, i agree that the mind stores similar concepts in similar (or same) places, say to maximize on storage space. kindof bucketing similar shades together in a pile, hence the apparent use of symbols in the dreams and our endless efforts are interpretting them. And the fact that the same memory region (read: a bunch of neurons working together representing a concept) might be linked in for many different scenarios, snakes, phallus etc, is all the more reason to have the dream because the effects of any changes made are kindof non-deterministic (more accurately: extremely hard to predict), and hence dreams are a necessity. Does this mean that for very new and novel concept, since it doesn't have a close cousin of an idea, doesn't require dream activity to validate itself (or changes made to it) since the concept lacks complexity?

Unknown said...

Might i also say, that the activity of dreaming can be seen in the light of evolution, in the absence of such mechanism, the delta (difference) between the actual world and the model of the actual world in the head, would increase (or be tremendous), hence result in a lesser liklihood of survival. Say a gazel that doesn't quite think that a lion is a threat will likely perish, even after repeated ealier close calls, if it doesn't accurately represent the real world in its model in the brain. Other that do it well, will survive, so dreaming can be seen as a quality check mechanism.

expended libido said...

Delta is an excellent way to put it in.
The delta between perception and reality.